What happens when a marketer known for destination and experience marketing steps into an industry she knows little about? In this episode of The CMO Show, Mark Jones sits down with Michelle Rowling, Head of Marketing and Sales at Sydney Zoo,
Having transitioned from Luna Park Sydney to Sydney Zoo, Michelle Rowling shares why her focus has never been the product itself, but the experiences and memories people take away. Rather than positioning the zoo as a challenger to competitors, she's reshaping the brand around its own unique strengths, from accessibility and immersive animal encounters to the emotional connections families create when experiencing wildlife together.
The conversation also explores one of Australia's biggest emerging tourism opportunities: the opening of Western Sydney International Airport. Michelle reveals how Sydney Zoo is positioning itself to capture domestic and international visitors through creative partnerships, unique experiences and a deep understanding of traveller behaviour.
Along the way, she shares lessons on leadership, building trust in unfamiliar industries, balancing technology with authentic human experiences, and why the best marketers spend less time talking and more time listening. From conservation initiatives and community engagement to experience design and brand strategy, this episode offers a thoughtful look at how marketers can create lasting relevance by putting people, learning and purpose at the centre of their work.
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This episode of The CMO Show was brought to you by host Mark Jones, producers Niall Hughes, Kirsten Bables, Syd Le, and audio engineer Ed Cheng. This is an edited excerpt of the podcast transcript.
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Mark Jones:
In marketing, we love to communicate to people, to market to people, to get them to do something. But there's also another approach. If we have a community mindset, what does it take to actually spend more time listening and learning so that we're building relationships that last?
Hello, and welcome to The CMO Show. Mark Jones is my name. Great to have you with us. The CMO Show is brought to you by ImpactInstitute, in partnership with Adobe. Now, my guest today is Michelle Rowling. She's the head of marketing and sales at Sydney Zoo, which just for the record, is the big zoo not far from the new airport in Sydney, in Sydney's west. Now, the interesting thing about Michelle's story is that we've had her on the show before when she was at Luna Park, and so she's got a really interesting background in understanding communities, in experience marketing, and destination marketing. She's got this new role where she's come into a space where it's not been part of her experience. She's not spent a lot of time at zoos and with animals as a core part of her daily experience. And so getting to know a whole new environment has been a big part of her story. And it gets more interesting than that. It's all about how do you build relationships? How do you take advantage of a once in a lifetime moment where a new Sydney Airport is just as we record this about to literally take off, so to speak? So let's have a listen to Michelle, her story, and the experience of starting new in a completely different area. So thank you for coming back on the show.
Michelle Rowling:
Thank you for having me.
Mark Jones:
Now, last time I saw you was actually a bit more than an... Oh, probably a couple of years ago. At least. I've seen you before then.
Michelle Rowling:
We've been seeing each other.
Mark Jones:
Between. Yeah. Point is, you've come from Luna Park to the new job at Sydney Zoo, and I want to learn all about this. We're going to talk about the airport as well, and destination marketing.
Michelle Rowling:
Very exciting.
Mark Jones:
First question, though, favourite animal?
Michelle Rowling:
Favorite animal? Look, favourite animal at the zoo, probably the lemurs.
Mark Jones:
Okay.
Michelle Rowling:
They're pretty exciting, pretty enticing, and they—
Mark Jones:
But they also freaked you out, right?
Michelle Rowling:
They freaked me out, but they keep the audience excited. Like, as soon as you arrive, they're right there. They're really engaging. They're always entertaining.
Mark Jones:
Madagascar. King Julian. This is my kids, right? They're all over this.
Michelle Rowling:
See? It's a crowd pleaser.
Mark Jones:
Okay. So you're not there just for the animals, though, are you?
Michelle Rowling:
No. I think the big opportunity for me moving to Sydney Zoo is I love working at places that offer good, exciting family memories, family engagement, family experiences. The idea that people of Sydney's photo albums are filled with places I work, that's pretty exciting. So that's definitely what was the draw card for Sydney Zoo, not necessarily the animals. The people that go.
Mark Jones:
I love that. That's, like, slightly controversial. It's like working at a car company and don't really care about cars, you know?
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah, but how good is that? Because then you can be the best marketer, converting people that didn't even know they were in the market.
Mark Jones:
It's true, actually. You've got a high bar for interest level, right? What's it actually going to take?
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah.
Mark Jones:
So, if we push into that a bit further, destination marketing has always fascinated me. If I go back to my memory of our Luna Park related conversation, you were talking about competing with Netflix. You were talking about how we need to get people's attention, and I think actually to get somebody out of their comfy chair and go to a place with all the kids usually, that's—
Michelle Rowling:
It's a big day out. It's a big ask.
Mark Jones:
It's a lot of effort, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah. You're not asking for just share of wallet by way of paying for the ticket. You're competing with their time, their other commitments. And yeah, all of that effort to actually have a day out at the zoo, it's a big task.
Mark Jones:
Right. Yeah. And also, of course, the climate, economically speaking, right? So—
Michelle Rowling:
Oh, massively. Massively.
Mark Jones:
So what's the strategy that you've got? Can you give us a picture of the marketing strategy that you've developed since arriving?
Michelle Rowling:
Of course. So look, when I first arrived at the zoo, I inherited an amazing team, amazing assets, and an incredible brand. So I was very lucky, very privileged. But what I found was really interesting is that Sydney Zoo had been anchoring itself to being the challenger zoo and the competitor zoo. Even six years in at the time, they were referring to themselves as the new zoo, and while that's amazing and exciting, the brand positioning was a lot bigger than that. We needed to actually really promote and sell ourselves on the unique reasons why you would get in the car and go all the way out to Eastern Creek. It's not really accessible by public transport with ease. It's actually quite a big ask. So making sure that we could sell ourselves on our points of difference in our own right, rather than being our points of difference compared to the other amazing institutions that there are.
Mark Jones:
So you had to move beyond the number two-type mentality as a story, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Of course. Yeah. And that was what was exciting, because when I was at Luna Park, we were the only roller coasters in Sydney. It was actually, you know, the best view of the fireworks. It was really easy to try and drive a reason why you should go to Luna Park. But the concept of being a challenger brand, I was really excited by that.
Mark Jones:
Yeah. I remember, this is kind of a parallel world, but Avis was quite famous for its marketing slogan around "We Try Harder." Right? Number two challenger brand, but talking about its point of difference was quality of experience, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah, yeah.
Mark Jones:
So then what is the storyline that is feeding through into the different channels? Like, how do you bring that to life?
Michelle Rowling:
Well, at the original point that I arrived, the zoo was marketing itself on accessibility, flat surfaces, and I guess being a really, what we were talking about before, the idea that it is a lot of effort to go to the zoo. So if it's easy to get your pram out of the car, and go straight into a flat and accessible zoo, it's a much better day. But inadvertently, they were doing that in a way that was sort of having a dig at the idea that Taronga's on an incline, right? That's not my style. I'm all about making sure that we can really promote Sydney Zoo for the flat offering that it is, and ultimately showcase other points of difference as well. Beating the same message for six years, it's going to fall flat — pun not intended. So we need to look at other reasons to come and visit Sydney Zoo.
Mark Jones:
Yeah. Now tell me about the emotive side of this story, because obviously ease, lack of friction from a buyer perspective — I'm just thinking of parents with strollers that you spoke about. That's a selling point, but if I compare it to Taronga Zoo in terms of an emotional centre for many people in Sydney, right? It's this historic sort of feel-good thing. So what's the equivalent emotion that you really go after at Sydney Zoo?
Michelle Rowling:
The one thing I've learnt through arriving at Sydney Zoo and experiencing the zoo through many eyes — so I'm working really closely with ITOs in our inbound tourism area, I'm working with young families, older people, like it's Grandparents Day this Sunday and we're actually hosting an event out at the zoo — I love the idea that animals are accessible to everybody, and you can see animals through their eyes. So that's actually something that I'm hoping to lean into in months to come. Watch this space, but the idea that at Sydney Zoo you can get closer to animals, and you can experience animals through the eyes of your child, through the eyes of keepers. When they're talking to you, the excitement and knowledge that radiates from them is actually forming part of that emotional experience and the connection that you will then have with that animal. Not just you seeing it in an enclosure, you hearing and learning all about it, and then seeing your child excited by it. That's essentially the emotion I need to sell.
Mark Jones:
You know, I love the flip about that. In movies, they say, you know, never work with animals and kids.
Michelle Rowling:
No, I love it.
Mark Jones:
It's the opposite, right? That's the joy.
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah, that's the part I'm having fun with. Yeah.
Mark Jones:
And I got to say, as a father myself, that is absolutely true in terms of a human truth, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah. We don't go to the zoo to see the animals. We go to the zoo to see our family see the animals. And I think that's definitely the opportunity that we have.
Mark Jones:
Can I cheekily ask you about the elephants? Because you have elephants.
Michelle Rowling:
We have elephants. We have two elephants. They are brothers. They are very happy, and their pool is seven meters deep. They can completely immerse themselves in that pool and jump right out. And we have an incredible caring team, and they actually set up the most amazing enrichment challenges for those elephants, and they are very, very inspired. They're very, very sweet.
Mark Jones:
So you're not going to see elephants anywhere else, is what I'm saying?
Michelle Rowling:
Nowhere else in Sydney, no. That's correct.
Mark Jones:
Okay. So that's a bit of a coup, is it not?
Michelle Rowling:
It's exciting. It's definitely a draw card. And it's really exciting when we see people running towards them. When you arrive at Sydney Zoo, there's like three directions you can imminently go, and watching where people go first is actually the thing that tells you what they wanted to see the most. So when they make a turn left, I know they've come for the elephants.
Mark Jones:
It's like business class on a plane. All right. So that's really cool. The interesting thing now as we think about destination marketing, we've got the airport, right? Sydney's brand-new airport.
Michelle Rowling:
Western Sydney International Airport.
Mark Jones:
Which is now operational, right?
Michelle Rowling:
It's operational from this weekend. First flight's Sunday. First international arrival is Monday. So the team from Sydney Zoo, we have been working very, very closely with the Western Sydney Airport team. We have been present at all of their passenger trials. They did some testing, and that was incredible. You'd have 1,000 people giving up their free time, willing to go through all the hassle of boarding a plane, going through security, dragging a suitcase around. People are so excited about this airport that they're doing that willingly just to be test dummies, essentially, just for an opportunity to see the new airport and say that they were one of the first to go through there. And to meet those people — we were doing 1,000 each day, two trials a week for a month — and there was repeat visitors, people that were just so keen to see it. And then you'd meet families that have families flying in, and they just wanted to come and do a little bit of a test, you know, like Kath & Kim style. Like, actually go out and see the airport before they got there, and it was just amazing to meet them, and it just shows how exciting and enriching that airport is going to be for the entirety of Western Sydney and beyond.
Mark Jones:
So what are you doing from a marketing perspective — are we talking about lots of displays, lots of, you know, have you got opportunity to stick the brand up all over the airport? What are you going to be doing?
Michelle Rowling:
Oh, look, that's a user-pay situation at Western Sydney Airport. And at the moment, there's a lot of brands that, as you would expect, similar to when you arrive at Kingsford Smith, you see the Optus ads, you see the Samsonite ads. Sydney Zoo can't compete with that. Which, again, I love the challenge. So how can we actually get our brand in front of people? Very exciting — do they let elephants in?
Mark Jones:
Do they let elephants in?
Michelle Rowling:
They won't let elephants in. But they will let some reptiles. So there's some things that other brands can't do, and we will have some mascots present as well. We'll actually be giving out tickets to Sydney Zoo to the first thousand people that fly into Western Sydney Airport. So as they get off the plane, "Here's a ticket. Come see the zoo." It's just about having that presence, and having that affiliation, and then being proactively endorsed by the airport team. That's real privilege as well.
Mark Jones:
People are not going to get off a plane at Western Sydney Airport and go straight to your zoo, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Why not?
Mark Jones:
Well, I mean, they might.
Michelle Rowling:
If I'm offering a koala breakfast, are you thinking they don't want to get off the plane and have breakfast with the koalas?
Mark Jones:
Well, I think this is the challenge, right? So we're talking about customer behaviour. Because the risk is they go to their hotel and then—
Michelle Rowling:
And they sit down and wind down.
Mark Jones:
Yeah, and you've lost them, right?
Michelle Rowling:
No, I haven't lost them. So we're offering new products. We've always had a koala breakfast, but the idea that we can now really market that to the inbound space and actually say, "Hey, when you first get off the plane, there might be a few hours before you're allowed to even check in to your hotel. So why not stop at Sydney Zoo, have a morning tour, see the animals wake up, and have breakfast with the koalas?" So that's a true product that we offer now that we'll be elevating. And we're really excited about those 24/7 flight paths when they do come in because you've checked out of your CBD hotel, or you might be staying anywhere across Sydney, and you can actually do a nocturnal tour before you get on the plane. You can actually head to Sydney Zoo as the last thing you fit in before you leave Sydney. That's pretty impressive.
Mark Jones:
What did it take to develop those products?
Michelle Rowling:
So, like I said, the koala breakfast product already exists. And it's about working with our animal care team to make sure that all of those offerings are really in line with animal welfare. So, you know, we have different rules and regulations that we need to follow, but then we go one step further and have a level of expectation of how we want to care for our animals. So the idea that if you were to touch or pat an animal repeatedly throughout the day, hundreds of tourists, that's not really a very nice experience for that animal. So we obviously make sure that we're doing everything we can to make sure that our animals are well cared for and happy. And that actually makes them more forthcoming, more present in their enclosure, because they can actually feel comfortable and at home, and then everyone gets a better view.
Mark Jones:
Which parts of your different experiences — if I think about some of the places you've worked in the past, not just at Luna Park, but you've been in... Like, was it a legal firm, I think, going back?
Michelle Rowling:
I was actually at Bankstown Sports. So my role before Luna Park Sydney was actually working with Western Sydney, but in a hospitality and gaming space.
Mark Jones:
Yeah. So I think from a listener or viewer's point of view, they're sort of thinking about, what are the experiences that you think led up to this pinch me moment? What are the real skills that set you up for this moment, do you think?
Michelle Rowling:
I did think about that quite a lot when I first was offered my role at Sydney Zoo. To even get that phone call was such a huge privilege and opportunity, and it's so easy to sink into the why me? Why are they calling me? What have I got to offer? But the idea that every phase of my career has been catering to, I guess, not consumers, but visitors. I've never actually marketed a tangible product. The idea that every job I've had has been an experience — that's something I find pretty exciting, and I think that's what's helped me get to where I am.
Mark Jones:
Right. So you've always had either an intuitive or a very focused sense of what is this customer experience. This has been the thing that's driven you.
Michelle Rowling:
And end to end, right? Like, not just when you arrive, or when you're visiting, or when you're consuming. It's the idea that we've got a digital footprint that we own that needs to organically and wholesomely get you there. No one goes to the places they feel that they've been overtly advertised. They go to the places that they have that emotional connection with.
So the idea that we can have a conversation and tell a story about our location before people even arrive, and involve people in that story, that's something that I've always found in every role has been really, really important. But then making sure that the experience that you have with us is true to what you did see in market. No one wants to be served a bad meal or appreciate that what they saw online is very different to what they've now come to.
So just making sure that that end-to-end experience is seamless and on point, and that's been something that has been interesting because I can't always control that. So the idea that you can offer the best menu, the screen designs can be fabulous, the restaurant looks amazing, and then they get a bad meal, or they get a good meal but the customer thinks it's bad. Like, I can't control that. But it is something that we obviously do everything we can, and it's about working with the other departments.
In every organization, I've made it a priority to make sure that I'm working with that frontline team, from operations to food and beverage. If I'm not collaborating with them, how can I market what they're offering?
Mark Jones:
How do you build the relationships? What's your approach to getting that right? We hear a lot in digital marketing about customer experience, but it's seen through the lens of how you're served individual ads, or other pieces of digital content. You're actually talking about human skills here, right? So what's your approach, or maybe the advice you would offer to people who are trying to really collaborate in very constructive ways?
Michelle Rowling:
Well, I think it's interesting because when I arrived at the zoo, it was well known that I'd never worked with animals before. So I can only imagine, it would be fair to say, that some of the team who've been ingrained in that industry for a long time would be going, "What's this girl going to do? What's she going to do?" And then same when I was at Luna Park, I'd never worked in the attraction space before. So is she going to know a rollercoaster from a drop ride? Is that going to be something that she can actually market? So it's about building a relationship and building trust with those people that are the gospels within the industry. Who's worked there?
And I'm not just saying the oldest person in the team or the person that's been there the longest. It's about essentially partnering up with the person or the team that is the custodian of knowledge and then soaking up as much knowledge as you can get from them. I think that's something that's really, really important. And collaborating and sharing, and then hopefully you can get that to a point where they actually trust your marketing.
So if you're actually asking, "Hey, can we shoot that from another lens, or can we do something a bit differently?" they're getting on board. I remember it's such a small example, but when I arrived at one of my workplaces, the chef — I was like, "How am I going to work with this head chef? Like, we've got nothing in common. He doesn't know me. I don't know him." And it got to a point only a few weeks in that I convinced him to do a photo shoot for Valentine's Day with a rose in his mouth. We're great friends now. Like, you actually can break down those barriers just by getting to know people and being your authentic self.
Mark Jones:
I presume that means you ate his food. Right?
Michelle Rowling:
Every day. It was wonderful.
Mark Jones:
Okay. So what I'm hearing is the lesson here is about listening, learning, getting to know people, build the relationship first before you then start coming in with your commands and your big ideas, which is—
Michelle Rowling:
You could have the best idea. But if you try and throw that at people on day one, that's going to be a hard pill to swallow.
Mark Jones:
So you are now in an interesting position where you're starting to look beyond as well. I know that you went to a zoo and aquariums conference in Auckland?
Michelle Rowling:
We recently went to the ZAA Conference in Auckland. And yes, it was actually a massive learning experience for me because—
Mark Jone:
I didn't know, by the way, there were conferences for zoo people.
Michelle Rowling:
They are some of the best conferences, can I tell you.
Mark Jones:
So one of the things that I found amazing about attending ZAA is that it was really evident right from the get-go that I was one of the most junior in the room by way of animal knowledge and animal experience. So everyone that was there were essentially CEOs or they'd worked with different species — they're species coordinators, they're animal trainers — and then there was Michelle from marketing. And what I found really amazing about that is no one judged me. There was no challenge or friction. It was all about how could they share their passion, how could they share their knowledge, and they were really open and receptive to what can this marketer bring from a new industry.
I'm interested in the practical ideas you took out of the conference that maybe you're going to start applying.
Michelle Rowling:
Okay, so I guess something I'd never... We, as marketers, we're always encouraged to market thoughtfully, buy media thoughtfully. We think about the environmental impact of the marketing that we purchase and consume, right?
And it's down to what colour should you use on the billboard, or what colour should you decal that vehicle so that it doesn't overheat the air conditioning, right? These are the kind of conversations that I'm having with other marketers.
But in the zoo industry, it's all about how can we actually preserve and evolve the environment? How can we actually work together to make it a better space for all? And how can we actually involve the community in that crusade?
So it's not just about leaving a zero footprint. It's about actually enticing the community to do the same. So one of the smallest ideas that we obtained from the ZAA conference is actually the idea that you can donate browse to the zoo. So browse is the leaves that the animals eat. And if you have an applicable gum tree or an applicable plant in your home, like bamboo for example — you could have a bamboo problem at your home, you've got a hedge that you need to have cut down, and you're just going to put it in your green bin — little did you know that that could actually be breakfast for one of the animals tomorrow.
So obviously, the idea of donating that would be really nice and humbling for you. You'd feel really good about yourself. And the keepers would feel really amazing going out and meeting and collecting and helping their animals by going and getting that for them. So we're actually in the process of setting up a donation registration, if you will, where people can actually be educated on the types of plants that we're looking for, and then they can actually submit photos and submit an interest form to actually be one of the contributors to the browse at our zoo.
Now, Auckland Zoo are doing that already really, really well with lots of success. You can imagine the branches and food that you need to feed the animals — it's huge, it's extensive.
Mark Jones:
Have you got any big above the line, you know, big showy things coming up?
Michelle Rowling:
Oh, look, I do. So we're actually in the background working on a new brand campaign. And while that's something that's really interesting and exciting, I just want to stress that I am really grateful for the brand that I've received — the colours, the logos, the positioning, everything's on point.
So it's not a rebrand. It's actually how can we get that out further and wider? How can we actually make this message a lot stronger? And then how can we build a brand catalogue that will help promote us for a long time to come?
We've got a lot of things coming up in the new year. We've got new animals coming. We've got new experiences coming, and I need to be able to have brand assets that will talk to each and every one of those. So making sure it's emotive and making sure it's applicable will be really, really exciting.
Mark Jones:
And is your target audience primarily Sydney's west or the entire Sydney basin? That's an interesting kind of cultural question, isn't it?
Michelle Rowling:
It is. It is. So at the moment, sure, the postcode data directs us to Hills and Western Sydney as being predominant visitors. But even where I'm located in Sydney, I'm halfway between Sydney Zoo and Taronga Zoo.
So if I was sitting there at home debating which zoo to visit with my family, I actually have a bit of a battle on my hands for a big portion of Sydney. Which one would they go to? But at the end of the day, there's lots of other animal experiences in Sydney as well. It's not just my main competitor. But yeah, I think we need to be talking to the whole of Sydney.
What comes with the airport is actually the idea that we're promoting domestically and internationally as well. So if you're coming to Sydney and you have an animal experience on your mind, how can I make sure that I am the one that you consider to be the most convenient, the most accessible, and will fit into your itinerary?
Mark Jones:
Now, I wanted to ask you about digital marketing because we haven't talked about AI yet, and every interview has to talk about AI, right? No, not quite. The thing that I've been reflecting on a lot lately is real-world experiences.
There seems to be a real community interest in making things more real or authentic, right? To get all of us away from our devices. But ironically, we have to photograph everything, right? We can't go to anything without sticking up the — right? So what are you doing to kind of blend those worlds?
Michelle Rowling:
Look, I think what has made my move to Sydney Zoo more interesting compared to previous roles is because I'm outdoors and because you're back having a really wholesome zoo experience, a lot of the toys and the opportunities that I had as a marketer have actually been stripped away as well.
So, I've had access before to heat mapping. I've had access to car park duration stay. I've had access to scanning on at every ride. Truthfully, I could very politely track every visitor I had and see how everything was performing.
At the zoo, I don't have the luxury of that. We literally have to get down to the basics and the marketing fundamentals to look around and watch people experience our product. We don't have the tech and the smarts that I've previously had access to.
Mark Jones:
Okay. So is that a bit unnerving?
Michelle Rowling:
No, I think it's exciting because it means that the whole point, as you've said, is coming back to a really enriching and exciting experience that is hopefully sans technology. Like, the last thing we want is kids walking around with iPads and touching screens at the zoo. They're there to experience the animal and have that emotional connection.
So look, truthfully, yes, people are getting their phones out and taking photos and creating content, but that's ultimately what I need them to do. So if they're doing that on their own free will, who am I to judge? And thank you so much. But we also do know that to strip that away from a family, in particular a child, and then encourage them to come to the zoo, that's not going to be very exciting.
So for example, we have put in an AR Gruffalo trail, and so the idea is that you're scanning signs inside the zoo, and you're trying to find the Gruffalo. So while that's really exciting and adds another point of elevation to your ticket — it's a free experience obviously — there's been many attractions that have used that to try and essentially encourage children to engage with the experience that they're having. My friends at Scenic World had done that for many, many years. And it was a really exciting opportunity for us to bring that trail into the zoo.
Now, truthfully, has that meant that I've received feedback from people saying, "Hang on a minute, you were encouraging people to get off their phones, and now they need to use a phone"? Yeah, cool, I agree, but that option's there for those families who choose to engage. I'm not suggesting every family needs to have a phone or an iPad to utilize the experience of coming to the zoo.
Mark Jones:
I don't know every listener of ours, by the way, understands what a Gruffalo is. I've got kids, right?
Michelle Rowling:
Well, look, The Gruffalo — it's a children's book. Yeah, it's very exciting. I reckon The Gruffalo has got a bit of a footprint.
Mark Jones:
It's like a monster type thing, right? Yeah. No, I do like — Julia Donaldson.
Michelle Rowling:
Julia Donaldson. Yeah.
Mark Jones:
No, fantastic. I think the parallel there is when you see fast food restaurants partnering with movies. So your natural sort of partnering space is books and imagination and creativity. All that world — the spaces that kids inhabit.
Michelle Rowling:
Yeah. Our focus is education and conservation. If it can't be related or tied to that, then I think there's something wrong in where we're trying to take the direction.
Mark Jones:
Do you have a big picture in mind as to where you want to see all of this work go? Like, describe the sort of mindset you've got. What's the vision for how all these stories are going to unfold?
Michelle Rowling:
Look, I think if I can offer an experience to Sydneysiders and beyond that they found entertaining, but also left with a little fact, a little piece of education that they didn't have before they arrived, and every time you visit, you learn something new, not just once — to me, that's really humbling and really, really exciting about the product that we have, but that's really shortsighted.
So also long-term strategically, if we can be seen as a for-profit zoo — like at the end of the day, we are a business — but a business that's doing good in the world, a business that's contributing to conservation, that's contributing to wildlife, that's contributing to animal welfare standards that are beyond expectation, then that's really exciting for me.
Mark Jones:
Michelle, thanks for coming in on the show again and joining me, and I'm so loving the energy and excitement you've got for this role and where it's going. Yeah, all the best with the airport and all the exciting—
Michelle Rowling:
Thank you. Yeah, it's a good time to do something different. I'm really enjoying it.
Mark Jones:
Thank you.
Michelle Rowling:
Thank you.
Mark Jones:
One of the interesting things about Michelle's experience is just how much collaboration there is between different zoos around Australia, and in fact, internationally, and she spoke about the biodiversity that's a big part of that. I think it's a real challenge for a lot of us in highly competitive industries. There are actually spaces, ideas, there's areas that we can move into where actually collaboration could be the proverbial rising tide that floats all boats.
So maybe that's a great idea for you to reflect on — where are those opportunities to grow, not just beyond your competitive set, but actually with them? So that's it for this episode of The CMO Show. My name is Mark Jones. Thanks for joining us. We'll see you next time.